THE IRISH PROVINCES are not as feared as they once were, according to former Leinster hooker Bernard Jackman on Monday’s subscriber exclusive Rugby Weekly podcast.
“I think everyone sees us now as beatable,” Jackman said.
“Glasgow came to Thomond Park and they saw an opportunity. Bulls didn’t get spooked by Leinster.
“Connacht obviously aren’t in the Champions Cup next year. Ulster look like they’re on their way back a little bit and made Europe which is great, but without more firepower are they really going to be contenders?
“The problem in Irish rugby at the moment is if you make an opinion that is in any way negative to the Irish team or a provincial team, you’re having a go for the sake of it, when actually you’re trying to be objective.
“That attitude of everything’s OK isn’t getting us where we want to be. OK, we’re winning Six Nations and a Grand Slam, that’s amazing, but in the bigger scheme of things I think our provinces have dropped off a bit,” Jackman told Gavan Casey and Murray Kinsella.
Munster’s failure to book their place in the URC Final following their 17-10 loss to Glasgow could be perceived as an ominous sign for what is to come for Graham Rowntree’s side next season, with many key figures, including Simon Zebo, having played their final game for the club.
“I don’t not believe in the coaches or anything like that, it’s just looking at that playing squad…” Jackman said.
“My argument with Munster is that I think next year they’re a bit older. For the likes of Tom Ahern and Alex Kendellen this is a good thing. But for Conor [Murray], for Pete [O’Mahony], for Stephen Archer, John Ryan and both Scannells… you’re maybe on the edge of performance.
“That’s not to disrespect any of the lads. They’re all playing really well at the moment, but you have to take that into account. How much more can you squeeze out of them?”
For all of Munster’s outgoings mixed with some ageing pivotal players, there are some positives, such as their signing of South African wing/fullback Thaakir Abrahams.
The 25-year-old joins in the summer after one year with Lyon where he scored five tries in 13 appearances, including four tries in the Champions Cup.
“Abraham is a good signing because they are lacking pace. But in an ideal scenario they’d have two speedsters for the way they want to play,” Jackman said.
“Having a lot of pace could be massively more effective than what they have to do at the moment. Right now they have to do everything right. Everyone has to make the right pass at the right time, fix a defender to be able to unlock defences… and they’re good at doing that.
“But they’re losing RG Snyman They were obviously unlucky with Jean Kleyn this year and there’s still concerns about his injuries. I think they’re definitely going to be weaker. Antoine Frisch is a big loss too.
“I just think their squad is a little bit back from where it was this year and unfortunately they haven’t retained their trophy and they got beaten in the last 16 in Europe, so you’d be slightly worried.
“The only [Irish] squad that I think is actually stronger next year is Leinster. The rest are all weaker, in my opinion.”
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I think for all the talk in the past few seasons that Leinster’s B team are the 2nd best team in the country, the answer is very clearly that they aren’t. The reason Leinster had to travel to play Bulls was because they sent their B team to SA in regular season, and came back pointless. For all their depth, their 2nd and 3rd team players are not getting enough high level exposure and are undercooked when they do. Outhalf a case in point – Byrnes, Frawley and Prendergast all sharing duties between them, but if one of them was at another province, they would almost certainly be playing week in week out. Leinster will argue that competing on two fronts requires high quality replacements, but it clearly didn’t work in the URC the last three seasons, and it is detrimental for the Irish team.
@JoeVlogs: this is more than just a Leinster issue. They’re still supplying the bulk of the talent. It will be refreshing to not hear certain out-halves being bigged up from now on though.
@JoeVlogs: Agrée. I think some of the fringe Leinster players are not improving as you’d expect from not playing enough games. In a way, it’s easier if you’ve a smaller tighter squad where all the squad members get decent match exposure. Of course, this breaks down when you get injuries, Munster are a case in point. We didn’t win a trophy but there were phases this season we looked good and injury hit parts where we struggled. Leinster had few injuries and there are loads of quality players holding tackle bags and play the odd URC game in 2nd/3rd string sides. Definitely the IRFU should look at imposing number restrictions on Leinster cause it’s not good for player development. It’s cover for Leinster if they get a run of injuries but is bad in every other way.
@Michael Corkery: number restrictions? Do you keep players on academy contracts? Maybe force them to move to a team they don’t want to play for? Or maybe not waste money with a youth system and stop bringing players through.
@Michael Corkery: Leinster are still set up like the old Pro 14, where there were 3 extra games with 2 games v teams like dragons, and games durning international windows meaning fringe players were able to get plenty of minutes. But dropping from 21 to 18 regular games, against tougher opposition like the SA sides, and fewer games in international breaks has seriously restricted the number of minutes available to fringe players. Sam Prendergast got a respectable 478 mins in the pro 14 he would have prob got near double that.Trector got 14 mins in old pro 14 he would have prob started a game or two.not sure if its the players or coaches havent realised that the number of mins to give fringe players gametime isnt what it was.
@chris mcdonnell: you restrict the number of senior contracts. You don’t force anyone to move but you don’t give them a senior contract – they would eventually move then anyway if they wanted to play pro rugby. I can understand why Leinster do it – they can absorb a lot of unavailability and still be relatively competitive but it’s not a great model for the players on the fringes – they need to be playing more. Something for Himphries to dig his teeth into
@Kingshu: that’s true. Remember though Ross Byrne was out injured for quite a while and others would have had even less game time if that hadn’t happened.
Munster had similar issue when they had Crowley, Healy, Carbery and Jake Flannery on the books although Carbery was rarely available. Not enough game time for everyone. Leinster pretend they don’t see Frawley as an OH despite him being the OH bench option for big games and most people outside Leinster (including a certain Andy Farrell) seeing him as their best OH.
@JoeVlogs: I don’t think this is true. The.seeming growing gap in quality between the first and second teams is probably more to do with Neinaber’s late start and the challenge of implementing a completely new defence structure across a squad of 40 plus players. Neinaber only started in January and the first team were away for the Six Nations a few weeks later. They were essentially out of the picture until after the Six Nations. It’s reasonable to assume the returning frontliners would then have got the majority of coaching attention as they moved into Champion Cup knockouts games. The mistake was probably not realising that this was a transition year and just focusing on the one competition they should be winning, the URC.
@JoeVlogs: I think Humphries has a big job on his hands and needs to push some provincial players around as well as developing depth at 10 and prop. He needs to move some of the Leinster players around.
It is beyond useless for the national side to have the likes of Deegan, Penney, H Byrne, T O’Brien, Clarkson and Foley sitting as 3rd/4th choice options for their positions, they immediately should be sent to Connacht on a season long loan.
Ross Byrne should be sent up North and let him be challenged out of the Leinster comfort zone, Richie Murphy is the prefect coach to help him re-invent himself
Lastly, we need to scour the world for Irish qualified props, we are desperately low on depth here as 2027 approaches, we are an Andrew Porter injury away from a major crisis
@Michael Corkery: pretty sure all 4 provinces reduced squad size due to reduced games when the season changed.
Munster have been gutted this past 12 months, with RG, Carbary, Healy, Earls, Frisch, Zebo and Conway all departed. The replacements are no where near their standards, Burns for Healy/Carbary, Farrell for Frisch. Carbary has been the second best 10 in Ireland since Xmas, Frisch would’ve have been a great addition to the Irish team at 13 rather than using Henshaw who has been found out in the position, Farrell backed the Byrnes brothers over Healy which the last 12 months have shown to be the wrong decision, the list goes on
@Liam23: farrell didn’t back the 3rd choice 10 at munster and never backed Ross byrne, he did include a young harry byrne as 3rd choice. He has now swapped pendergast as the young 10.
Munster didn’t back healy, that’s why he left, nothing to do with farrell.
@Liam23: I know he’s not played much but it’s a shame you never learnt how to spell Joey’s surname.
@chris mcdonnell: Farrell selected Byrne for 20 of his 23 caps; that is backing a player you halfwit.
@Justin Robinson: is that the best response you can manage, you should learn to play the ball and not the man
@chris mcdonnell: Farrell backed the 3rd choice Leinster outhalf and that hasn’t worked out and he is 4th choice at the moment
@John Buckley: Can you not be civil in your comments? You can have a discussion without reverting to personal attacks.
@John Buckley: stick to rugby commentary and not name calling.
Otherwise you will be muted.
@chris mcdonnell: Farrell brought Ross Byrne to the world cup.
He wasn’t far off being number 2 behind Sexton.
@chris mcdonnell: That’s categorically false. He got fewer minutes under in Rowntree’s first season but Healy was a regular starter and started, or featured heavily, in playoff games in all competitions for Munster. It was obviously the desire to play at the world cup that was the primary facror behind the moce.
@Liam23: farrell has often brought young players as development players, Harry was one of them. He’s now 2nd choice 10 at leinster. Luckily farrell can see he’s not good enough and has not selected him. His second choice 10 through the sexton era was carbury but last season dropped him for crowley, again showing great selection ability.
As for Ross byrne farrell only ever selected him when at the time either carbury or sexton were not available. Again. He tried bith burns and carty but quickly got rid.
Our gameplan has been figured out.
Ireland and the four provinces (to different degrees) all play a similar style of rugby that relies on superfast ruck ball and numerous passing options at all times. We’re either being met hard from opposing defences or being bullied at the breakdown currently. What’s more: some teams have started incorporating our attacking patterns into their own gameplan, so we’ve even lost that advantage.
A real injection of youth and fresh legs is badly needed and I’m not sure we’re going to get that on tour. I honestly would’ve treated the tour as a development tool and pick a newer/weaker cohort of players. South Africa do it plenty and so do NZ.
@Sam Bingham: SA and NZ do it plenty, as do most tier one nations other than Ireland. France bringing 19 new caps on sunmer tour and Scotland 10 new caps. Ireland were the only squad in the 2024 6 nations with no new caps, with every other team having 4+, worrying in the first tournament of a new world cup cycle. Furthermore will any of the 3 new caps going to SA see any actual game time? I would guess not.
@Sam Bingham: I’m not sure we can afford to play a very weakened team v SA. If they respond the same way in the Autumn internationals we end up risking a reduced crowd at the Aviva. Having 10,000 less at €60 each looses the IRFU 600k plus reduced revenue from programme sales and a potential knock on effect on TV/advertising income.
One side came within a meter of winning the CC, the other topped the league. I don’t think it’s all doom and gloom. We’ll see a much stronger Leinster next year , a rejuvenated Ulster and Munster always find a way to be competitive
@Owen ODonoghue: Exactly. Can’t remember who said it (Alan Quinlan maybe), but you’re never as good as they say you are but, likewise, you’re never as bad either.
@Ruaidhri MagFhloinn: the late Anthony Foleyquote
@Laup Ekrub: co-opted by Paulie
He’s certainly right about Munster. 3 of our frontline props 36 this year and 2 approaching 30; first choice locks 32/33; POM and Murray 35; Haley 30; Tom Farrell 31 in October; B Burns 30; the Scannells 32 and 31. JOD 30. Burns and Farrell, both fine players, would seem to be short term signings while what really needs is quality 25-27 year olds who have the potential first team status for 5-7 years. We definitely need to be lucky (for a change!) on the injury front next season.
@TL55: I genuinely think if we had edogbo and ahern we’d have won that.
@Brenda Collins: 100%… freakkin Klien as support!? shtop. People need to chill out, too much end of the season drama.
Ar a laghad, tá deireadh le aon caint faoi Reverse Byrne mar ceann de na leath-chúlaithe don foireann náisiúnta.
Ó féachaint ar na cluichí thar an deireadh seachtain, tá easpa imreoir chun greim a thógáil ar an gcluiche cosúil leis an slí a rinne Humphreys, O’Gara, O’Driscoll agus Mick Galwey. Cinnte d’fhág Sexton folús mór. Caithfidh daoine seasamh suas.
@Cillian Anthony: show off
The days of Irish provinces dominating URC and especially European Cups are well and truly over.
@Ray Ridge: you win the prize for best stating of the bleeding obvious
@SYaxJ2Ts: It wasn’t very obvious few years ago when I first said it though. Most people were predicting Leinster to dominate.
@Ray Ridge: we cant stay on top forever even the irish team i think next few years will be hard no more 6 nations wins id say but we will allways bounc back mayby we 3 years now nothing and go into the world cup low expectations might win it then
@Ray Ridge: I’d say you’ve been a doomsday kinda guy for ever so I’m sure you’ve been wrong a fair bit over the years
@Ray Ridge: as a Munster fan, Leinster still have by far the best and deepest squad in the URC I’m not convinced that their coaching staff is the best, mind they have lost 3 H-cup finals in a row and that definitely had an impact on their URC title challenge. No other URC squad has the strength to challenge on both fronts IMO.
@Ray Ridge: Leinster haven’t closed the deal, but been in three consecutive finals. I’d consider that being in the mix.
Every team has a time at the top I think we as Ireland have had ours .Judging by the comments above we are still infighting with our selfs instead of fixing the problem ie try something different stop trying to play like South Africa we can’t be prepared to lose a few games and try out new players and combinations like most of the international teams now.Or is it all about revenue I hope not what are we going to learn with the squad picked for South Africa if we win we learn nothing, just persist with the same old I doubt any of the debutants will be picked so to me a wasted opportunity
@Phillip Keohane: don’t underestimate what a win in the Republic would do for the confidence of the squad, considering we’ve only ever won there once in our history.
Lol. Everyone always saw us as beatable, bit dramatic.
Move Cullen to DoR and make Nienaber head coach.
This confusion of having a head coach with less knowledge and experience than his senior coach is not working.
Worked ok with Lancaster doesn’t work with Nienaber.
Showed up big time this year in the huge drop in performance when the B team took the field.
@Oran Burns:don’t let Nienebar near head coach
If Ireland were hammered in South Africa it would be a blessing. Ir would force Farrell to spread the net and rebuild to certain extent which he should be doing anyway. We are always more than competitive at under 20 so there are plenty of players to be considered and now is the time to be doing it in plenty time for the World Cup
All sides are beatable Leinster suffer from the need to rest players due the Internationals they play and the limited number of games players can play per season ( a wise decision of the IRFU )
The loss of Sexton has weaken Leinster in thee short term as neither Ross or Harry have a consistent kicking game and Frawley is in my opinion a better 12 than 10 .
Crawley has a better control of a game than Carberry but the backline outside him has yet to gel and while the forwards have carried Munster in most games some have their best days behind them and some are over rated as a consequence .
The other factor is that other teams have improved to the point there are few easy games or foregone results in the URC which may make the URC more competitive and improve attendances long term