IF THERE WAS anything good to come from Ulster’s miserable defeat at home to Zebre on Sunday, it was the fact that it happened the evening before David Humphreys gave his state-of-the-nation media address at Ireland’s training camp in Portugal.
The dire 15-14 loss in Belfast underlined the first major challenge of Humphreys’ tenure as IRFU performance director. The gap between Leinster and the three other Irish provinces is wide.
The Ireland squad for the Six Nations is another indicator of the issue. 23 of the 36 players selected for the championship play for Leinster, five for Munster, five for Connacht, and three for Ulster.
While Leinster have made three consecutive Champions Cup finals and can add world-class players like Jordie Barrett and RG Snyman to their cast of homegrown stars, the other provinces appear to be going backwards.
Munster won the URC in 2023 but have struggled to keep pace since. Connacht didn’t qualify for this season’s Champions Cup and currently sit 14th in the 16-team URC, with Ulster also in the bottom half of the URC after winning just one of their four games in the Champions Cup pool stages.
And there are fears that the gap between Leinster and the rest could grow wider.
Humphreys recognises the issue and said that it’s crucial for the IRFU to help the other three provinces to catch up.
“At this moment in time, Leinster have been unbelievably successful,” he said yesterday at Ireland’s team hotel in the Algarve.
“Everyone around the world of rugby is looking to what Leinster are doing in their system to produce the players and the success they’ve had. For me, it’s about making sure that Leinster remain where they are.
“We want Leinster winning Champions Cups, we want Leinster in finals of the URC, as we want all the provinces, but at this minute in time, that’s the level they’re competing at.
“So it’s much more a case of maintaining Leinster where they are, but making sure the support that goes to the other provinces allows them to continue their progression.
“Munster have been, in URC terms, very competitive for the last couple of years, it’s just making sure that I believe long-term Ireland success is very much supported by all of our provinces being really competitive.”
Humphreys revealed that the worrying signs aren’t just at senior professional level.
Right now, 50 of the 100 young players involved in the Ireland U18, U19, and U20 squads hail from Leinster.
There are 23 from Ulster, 17 from Munster, just seven from Connacht, and three more are Irish-qualified players based abroad.
“50% from one province is too much,” said Humphreys.
“Our system isn’t working properly but again it’s a credit to Leinster, so what we’ve got to try and do is reduce that reliance on Leinster across all our squads.”
What Humphreys was keen to stress is that the IRFU doesn’t want to impact Leinster’s ability to keep doing what they’re doing.
There has been a change in that regard anyway, with the provinces having to contribute 30% of national contracts from their provincial budgets for the first time this season, whereas they contributed nothing before now.
Leinster have 10 players on national contracts so that has had an effect on their budgeting but they still have financial powers that exceed the other Irish provinces. While all four Irish provinces get the same base funding from the IRFU, Leinster are able to supplement that strongly by doing things like taking their game against Munster to Croke Park in October, earning them a €1.7 million payday.
Leinster have a big population base to work with and a world-class schools system feeding players into their academy. They have done excellent work in fully harnessing those advantages.
Humphreys pointed out that the other provinces don’t have these elements in their regions and feels they must figure out their own wasy of doing things rather trying to mimic Leinster.
“I think the big message is that Leinster are where they are, they have a lot of unique parts to what makes Leinster successful, capital city and everything that comes with that.
“So rather than compare the other provinces and say, ‘Leinster have got this, the other provinces haven’t got that,’ it’s what’s right for each of those provinces and that’s very much going to have to be driven by them.
“They’re the ones on the ground. They’re the ones that are working in the schools and the clubs and at the grassroots, so it’s about trying to put a longer-term… as part of our strategic plan talk, we’ve talked about winning teams.
“Yes, of course, it’s Ireland teams but it’s also about getting our provinces back and what’s right for one isn’t necessarily right for all four. But we have to ensure the provinces close the gap to where the current difference with Leinster is.”
Non-Irish-qualified [NIQ] signings are one obvious way to boost the other Irish provinces, with Ulster bringing in powerful South African back row Juarno Augustus this summer.
But it seems that Munster, Connacht, and Ulster are in an increasingly weak position when it comes to competing for the top stars on the market.
Humphreys spoke about how the IRFU needs to be flexible when it comes to NIQ signings but his priority is clearly on ensuring the other three provinces are bringing through more homegrown players who can compete for green jerseys. There is a sense that the provinces can save funds for better NIQ players by reducing the amount they spend on their wider squad players.
Humphreys was also keen to underline that encouraging more Leinster players to move to other provinces is not the solution.
While that will always be part of the Irish rugby system – Leinster front rows Michael Milne and Lee Barron are set to join Munster this summer – Humphreys doesn’t believe it’s the key to improving the other provinces.
“In a high-performance system, you want your best players playing as often as you can,” said Humphreys.
“No question, that will help their development and the competitiveness of the other provinces but it’s never simply a case of ‘this player will move and we move him’.
“We will only move players who want to move and, again, the message back last summer was that when you don’t move, players are sending a very clear message around where their ambitions lie.
“Some players will, when they stay, accelerate their development. A bit of luck, bit of injury, form.
“What we can’t do… none of our other provinces can rely on that being the solution to some of their problems.
“The challenge with them is to make sure that we will continue to work with them to develop their pathways, to give other players opportunities to come through to allow them to develop the depth to be competitive across the length of a season.”
One tweak that Humphreys may pursue is more loan moves, whether from province to province or to clubs abroad in some cases.
He supported Leinster out-half Harry Byrne’s current loan move to Bristol given that the 25-year-old had barely played for his province this season amid strong competition for the number 10 jersey.
Humphreys said we could see more of that in the future if Leinster have other logjams.
“It’s definitely a potential tool. In an ideal world, all our players would be playing in Ireland but when there’s not opportunities, there is definitely an element where we have to get players game time.
“I’ve always maintained that, especially players in the spine of a team, you can train as hard as you like, you can experience really good training, but you’ve got to get out on the pitch, you’ve got to be put under pressure. We all know what a good player Harry is and to continue his development was making sure he got the appropriate game time. When this came along, he was keen to explore that option.
“Ideally, we have players playing in Ireland but we’re always open to opportunities that arise both short-term and long-term.”
Humphreys did confirm that there will be no change in Irish players falling out of consideration for the Ireland team if they move abroad permanently.
There is a recall clause in Byrne’s loan deal in Bristol, meaning he remains Ireland-eligible right now, but anyone who signs longer deals abroad won’t be considered for national team selection.
“That won’t change,” said Humphreys. “To be very clear, this is a short-term loan. Players who decide to leave the system, we won’t be selecting players from outside Ireland.”
The hope is that Byrne, who is contracted to Leinster for next season too, will return to Irish rugby having improved and make an impact again, even if that is with a different province.
As for the bigger picture, Humphreys and the IRFU hope to see Leinster continuing to compete for trophies as Leo Cullen’s men aim to end what will be a four-year wait for silverware by the end of this season.
And they know there is major work to be done to get the other provinces back into the mix.
There is optimism that Munster will be in a good place next season as they welcome in some good signings and push talented young players into more prominent roles and while Ulster and Connacht are seemingly coming from further back in their development, Humphreys knows it’s pivotal that they improve as soon as possible.
“When you talk about the four provinces being competitive, you’re talking about them all being in the Champions Cup,” said Humphreys when asked how the IRFU will gauge progress.
He also hopes to see the provincial breakdown of those underage squads and the senior national team becoming more balanced.
“That’s how we’re going to measure what success looks like in terms of closing that gap while also challenging Leinster to continue doing what they do.
“In terms of performance, the challenge is that you can’t ask all four provinces to set a goal of winning the URC. They might internally but from our point of view, you’re going to have three that then fail.
“So it’s more about making sure our provinces are competitive, Champions Cup rugby, and there’s just so many elements in the Irish system that come with how we define success which is retaining players, giving them opportunities, the player management system, having that level of durability for our players who are fit for key parts of the season.”
Humphreys has a big job on his hands.
Money is always going to win. I don’t see anything in this article that goes towards addressing the issue of Leinster being far more financially better placed than the other 3 provinces. “Grass roots” won’t cut it in professional sport. Share the wealth.
@Donie Bolger: it’s professional sport, not charity bud
@Donie Bolger: the 30% of central contracts?
@adizlack93: the article is about how the IFRU need to make sure the gap between the provinces is closed. Even the title says it! Have another go at understanding it, if you’re able.
@Donie Bolger: Munster are.given millions by IRFU every year. It’s up to Munster to use that money every year to build a successful model that works for them. The Leinster model won’t work, but there are other places to look. Exeter, Bristol, Saracens. All of those were a long building process. You could even look at Leicster City from soccer. A lot of these clubs had less resources than Munster or Ulster.
@Conor Lynott: the “millions” clearly isn’t enough, for Munster or the other 2, is it though? Cap on NIQ player numbers for M, C, U could be looked at as a short to medium term solution to level the field.
@Donie Bolger: You’re conveniently also forgetting the multi, multi million euro loan the irfu gave Munster. Repayable over 100 years. Interest free! Talk about handouts. Selective memory with lots of fans like you.
@Donie Bolger: how bout you produce a few international players for the first time in over a decade?? The fact that POM is the last Ireland forward to come out of your academy is terrifying from a Munster point of view
@Donie Bolger: Millions is more than enough if managed properly. I’d question whether it is being managed properly, Ulster recorded significant debt last year. There are successful organisations that start with less. Munster need to find a model that works. Copying Leinster won’t work, but there are other models that could work.
@Conor Lynott: contrary to what you state Ulster have been managing their budget extremely well especially given the additional costs incurred due to extra tax and VAT demands north of the border. One years debt was posted due in main to a cancelled European Cup match and penalties associated with that. So in summary don’t blame poor budget management for the situation Ulster find themselves in. The IRFU need to be more active in supporting the three ‘poorer’ provinces yet this interview with DH reveals almost nothing at all about how they intend to do just that.
@Conor Lynott: Due to different tax authorities Ulster start with approx £2m less than the other provinces each season. If the basic IRFU distribution is even, (doesnt include central contracts) then Ulster are losing out big time, and its no wonder theres financial issues, as its not a level playing field.
@Kingshu: so is that why you lost at home to Zebre then?
@Keno: IRFU are not a charity. They are an investor. They will keep the other three provinces afloat. But the other provinces can’t just bleed IRFU dry. They’ve got to prove that they can sort themselves out. IRFU have money, but they are not Elon Mosk. Ultimately at some point there has to be return on investment. What I’m seeing is that the IRFU are losing patience and Humphreys is throwing down the gauntlet. ‘Catch up on Leinster. We’ll support you, but we won’t spoonfeed you.’
@Conor Lynott: Sorry, Bristol and Leicester City, with their billionaire owners, have less money than Munster or Ulster? And wasn’t the model of Sarries, financed by their owner’s 300 million quid fortune, to cheat? And couldn’t Exeter sign who they wanted to become successful? Their promotion winning captain was the brother of John Hayes whilst their 10 was Steenson who was lost to Ulster because, somewhat ironically, his path was blocked by a certain veteran fly half…..
@Justin Robinson: They had to prove themselves profitable first so that those owners would see them as profitable. They didn’t spring into being with a billionaire benefactor.
@Conor Lynott: Profitable? You’re just talking nonsense now son.
@adizlack93: having an extra 8 top players or couple top players plus and extra £1.5m per year for last 20 years to invest in acamady probably would have helped.
@Justin Robinson: Oh, really? Then explain to me why billionaires would go near them without prior profitability. Billionaires are in it to make money, not to throw money away. You’re delusional if you think that they are investing out of emotion or blind love of an organisation That’s not how it works.
@Conor Lynott: You think that the owners of Sarries, Bristol and Leicester City have made money? You’re joking right? Leicester lost over two hundred million quid in their last three years in the Prem before they went down. Rowe at Exeter has pumped millions in. Professional sport is propped up rich owners, banks, tax losses and crime.
@Conor Lynott: FYI, levels of debt in the English football Premier League are 3.6 billion pounds….
@Justin Robinson: You do realise that the debt of the club and the personal debt of the club are separate, yeah? They can profit from the club and the club itself can be in trouble. Glazers do it all the time with man utd
@Conor Lynott: Personal debt of the owner
@Conor Lynott: Keeping with Rugby millionaire benefactors how much Money Peter Thomas make from Cardiff before he died? Esp considering that he wrote off £3.3m of debt owned to him. If you think this is the viaable model to go done, then you havent done your due diligence in research.
@Kingshu: My point is that every organisation must show some ability to stand on their own before attracting investment. No matter how much money someone has, if it’s not producing results, at some point the tap will be turned off.
@Conor Lynott: Look, it’s really not my job to educate you but Bristol Bears, for instance, have 60 million of debt, the vast majority of which is owed to their owner Landsdown which is in effect written off. Preston North End have lost 90 million in the last decade with 50 million converted into equity by the owners. PS If you ever win the Irish lottery don’t ‘invest’ it in a pro sports club for God’s sake…
@Conor Lynott: The opposite I think is true, the IRFU aim is to have the provinces more self sustainable, and less reliant on the IRFU, which means inreasing income from URC, Attendance, sponsorship etc, precovid Leinster attendance wasn’t great, but few HCup finals and big games, in come the big sponsors, and you’d have to conclude that Leinster are closer to self efficiency than the others and IRFU funding should therefore be reduced, and put into the other three untill they can build the same self efficiency.
@Justin Robinson: OK last comment from me. A team could be £1bn in debt and it wouldn’t make 1 jolt of difference. In private limited companies, the owner is not liable for the debts of the company. So the owner is able to receive an income stream, separate to anything the company. Running a FC as a sole trader would make no sense. But as long as the owner is able to continually receive income from the company as a dividend, the.owner doesn’t really care. There are plenty of companies in debt that still pay owners.
@Kingshu: While it makes sense in some ways to reduce the amount that Leinster get, there’s a risk that it jeapordises the success at Leinster.
@adizlack93: silly comment. Munster have produced a ton of excellent forwards. Loads and loads of them putting in strong performances week over week for years. As have the other provinces. The players and the provinces can’t control whether or not the national coaches select them in squads or give them minutes.
@Conor Lynott: “must have some ability to stand on their own.”
Completely ignores the economic difficulties experienced across the country post-2009 and again during covid, followed by the cost of living pressure post/covid, and how this might affect household income, match attendances, and resources available to clubs. Obviously these are problems and everyone on the island m has to deal with it, but the impacts are much more easily absorbed across a larger population base with larger local economies. The recovery is slower outside of Leinster, so it’s hard to expect the same resilience in the provincial and grassroots game when they simply have different resources and challenges.
@Brenda Collins: I think the idea is that the provinces do control whether national coaches select their players, by influencing the skillset the players develop.
Either he’s deliberately not giving anything away or there is no plan in place yet to close the gap. Not sure to make of that really.
@Michael Corkery: The one size fits all concept won’t work for Irish rugby and regardless none of the other 3 provinces are capable of replicating anything near what Leinster do.
However, we have to get out of this nonsense of a type of help being afforded one province and the other 2 immediately crying foul like children.
For me a case in point would be RJ Snyman. He wanted to stay with Munster and Munster wanted to keep him but because Jean Klein had gone back to SA Munster had to make a choice and given the injury profile of both players, they rightfully choose Klein.
However, for the sake of making Munster a better team, even within the limits of what one man can do, a sensible exception should have been made to leave both Snyman and Klein at Munster.
A successful team raises its profile, gets more numbers on seats, improves morale etc.
However, we all know that if the IRFU did that there would be an outcry from Connacht and Ulster.
Personally, I don’t give a hoot what help the IRFU give the other 2 provinces as long as Irish rugby is in the healthiest possible state.
@Stanley Marsh: “However, we all know that if the IRFU did that there would be an outcry from Connacht and Ulster.”
This has not been the rule, but the exception, when they can point to a similar hypocritical scenario, and the ire is pointed at the IRFU, not the other provinces.
I literally can not recall Connacht doing the above once ever, and with Ulster only the Pienaar scenario.
Happy to be proven wrong, with some examples mind you.
@Michael Corkery: he didn’t say anything new really, did he? Won’t force players to move. Players who move abroad won’t play for Ireland. Players who are happy to sit on the benches will be less appealing as Ireland options (but don’t think the Irish coaches are listening to that). Leinster has unique advantages that we can’t replicate in other provinces. Provinces must figure it out. Pretty much the same old.
@Stanley Marsh: yes but also they wouldn’t even have needed to make an exception around Kleyn/Snyman had they fairly rewarded Kleyn’s excellent with a cap. Not good enough for Ireland, doesn’t fit the system, no sympathy caps, blah blah blah. Good enough for SA and has more RWC medals than any of our players. Had they played him in an RWC warmup Snyman would probably still be with Munster. But no.
@Brenda Collins: So you wanted to capture cap Kleyn and deprive him of World Cup medal? There’s self centered and then there’s Brenda.
@Stephen Nolan: oh take your naive moralizing somewhere else. I said I wanted a player who’d shown excellent form to be rewarded with a cap with the Irish team because he deserved it. He didn’t, and the province had to carry the cost of that decision.
Compare the teams during the weekend leinster and Ulster .
Leinster fielded 8 Internationals ,1 (F) 1 (SA) 2 (NZ -1 IQ ) and 4 Irish Internationals.
Four were backs wing centre out half and scrum half
Four were forwards 2 in the front row 1 second row and one back row
Ulster on the other hand fielded a backline which included an out half and two centres whose total ulster caps were less than the irish caps of the least capped Leinster player
All the players on the Ulster side were IQ
When considering the seven non Internationals who played for Leinster there is not one who would be a substantial improvement on the players field by Ulster
Nor do the the other irish provinces benefit from the generosity of Irish referees to the same extent as leinster at the breakdown 50/50 calls at the breakdown 7 out of 10 times will be given to leinster ( — Hanson wasn’t totally incorrect in his assessment –his guilt was to actually identify the fact )
The fact is at school level leinster school boys seem to get preference over boys from other provinces . and generally speaking on an individual level i doubt if there is sufficient difference between the best school boys in each Province but in my opinion the preference shown to leinster school boys has a negative affect on school boys in other Provinces who see restricted future in the game .
Basically Irish Rugby has a lobsided attitude to the game where Leinster benefit from resources numbers, finance and team strengthening (NIQ ) far in excess of other provinces
@SAMUEL T McGLADERY: Ok, then let’s compare how many players Leinster didn’t have available, due to Irish selection compared to Ulster. It was 21 players compared to 3. It would have been 24 except 3 of Leinsters team on Saturday needed minutes. The issue is and has been for some time, that Leinster produce the vast majority of the players in the Irish squad. That is heavily influenced by demographics but it still highlights a massive underperformance in development by the other provinces.
@SAMUEL T McGLADERY: Leinster had very few NIQ players for quite a long period if I remember correctly. They do benefit from sponsorship and ticket sales that are driven by being a (largely) winning team, as well as access to large stadia. However, I don’t believe there is a policy against the other provinces. As Leinster are only one quarter of the IRFU wouldn’t they get outvoted if that was suggested?
Part of the downside of the secrecy over the finances of Irish rugby is that people are shielded from the reality that the IRFU is already subsidising all the provinces to the tune of millions; easy to say that more should be given to the poorer provinces, but the IRFU is already a lossmaking organisation, which is committed to ploughing more money into the women’s’ pro game; so where is it to come from?
@Kevin Ryan: Exactly.
@Kevin Ryan: You mean there aren’t avenues in D4 lined with magic money trees? I’ll have a good look on Saturday.
@Justin Robinson: well there kinda are. That’s capitalism for you
I guess you look at what Leinster schools give the young players and try to deliver it in a different way. I guess it’s coaching, nutrition and access to S&C. So can you equip clubs outside Leinster better, maybe with mobile equipment that could be brought to the players, or can you set up training centres in smaller cities?
So many rubbish takes. “The IRFU isn’t a charity”.
It absolutely is within the remit of the IRFU to fund Irish rugby operations. Not only aspects that run a profit. No clubs run profit, should the IRFU stop funding them? They don’t draw a line under each aspect’s profitability as long as the overall Union’s books balance. Which they do.
@David Hickey: The IRFU’s Annual Report shows that they incurred a loss of €18.4mn in the year to July 2024
So Harry will return to “Irish rugby”… not necessarily Leinster? ;)